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MR. HUNTER : I shall not move my able Baron Basing, the Right Honourable Sir Amendments.
Henry Selwin-Ibbetson, and the Right Honour.
able John Tomlinson Hibbert.”—Mr. Ritchie.) MR. MASON (Lanark, Mid): I recog. Question, “That those words be there nize that this Bill is a distinct advance inserted,” put, and agreed to. with regard to the Office of Secretary
Clause, as amended, agreed to. for Scotland ; and I move, as I have been requested, that the date on which Clause 1 (Short title). it sball come into force shall be altered MR. RITCHIE: I now move in from the 1st of January, 1888, to the Clause 1, line 9, after “England," to 1st of November, 1887.
insert “and Wales." Amendment proposed, in Clause 4, to
Amendment proposed, in page 1, line leave out "first of January, 1888," and 9, after “England," to insert " and insert “first of November, 1887." - Wales.”—(dr. Ritchie.) (Mr. Mason.)
Question proposed, “That those words
be there inserted." Question, “That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Clause,”
MR. RADCLIFFE COOKE (Newing. put, and negatived.
ton, W.): I think it would be extremely
undesirable to insert those words, beQuestion, "That the words proposed cause there is an Act of George II. be there inserted,” put, and agreed to. which declares that wherever the word
THE LORD ADVOCATE(Mr. J.H. A. "England " is used in Statutes it shall MACDONALD) (Edinburgh and St. An- include Wales. We have quite enough drew's Universities): I beg to move the to do without passing laws twice over
. third reading of the Bill.
MR. RITCHIE: We do not think
that the Amendment is necessary; but Motion made and Question, “That we very frequently have to put into the Bill be now read the third time,”- Bills words which are not of themselves (The Lord Advocate,) —put, and agreed to. necessary. I believe that the Welsh Bill read the third time, and passed.
Members desire to have these words in. serted.
MR. CONYBEARE (Cornwall, CamLOCAL GOVERNMENT BOUNDARIES BILL.-[Bill 324.]
borne): I think that my hon. Friends
who represent Welsh constituencies (Mr. Ritchie, Mr. Jackson, Mr. W. H. Long.)
know what they want. This Amend[Progress 8th September. ]ment is a concession to the Welsh people, Bill considered in Committee.
and I am, therefore, glad that the right (In the Committee.)
hon. Gentleman has proposed it. Clause 2 (Constitution of Boundary
Question put, and agreed to. Commission).
MR. RITCHIE moved in page 1,
line THE PRESIDENT OF THE LOCAL 12, after “England” to insert
is and GOVERNMENT BOARD(Mr. Rırcuie) Wales.” (Tower Hamlets, St. George's): The Amendment proposed, in page 1, line Commissioners whom the Government 12, after “ England” to insert "and propose to ask the House to appoint Wales.”—(Mr. Ritchie.) are - Earl Brownlow, Lord Edmond Fitzmaurice, Lord Basing, Sir
Question, “That those words be there Selwin-Ibbetson, and Mr. John Thomas inserted,” put, and agreed to. Hibbert. I beg to move that these Clause, as amended, agreed to. names be inserted in the clause. MR. TOMLINSON (Preston) :
Remaining Clauses agreed to.
I think there is a mistake in the last Bill reported; as amended, considered. name. I believe it should be John
Bill read the third time, and passed. Tomlinson Hibbert. Amendment proposed, in Clause 2, to
ADJOURNMENT. insert at end
Motion made, and Question proposed, “ The Right Honourable Earl Brownlow,
“That this House do now adjourn.". Lord Edmond Fitzmaurice, the Right Honour-|(Mr. Jackson.)
plorable occurrence, would have deemed CRIME AND OUTRAGE (IRELAND) –
it a sufficient reason to suppose that a FATAL RIOTS AT MITCHELSTOWN. Question would be addressed to the
Mr. SEXTON (Belfast, W.): Before Government. the House adjourns I wish to put a Mr. W. H. SMITH: I have received Question to the Head of the Govern- no official information. ment. Intelligence of the utmost gravity MR. CONYBEARE: But they aphas arrived to-night from Ireland, and, parently know what had occurred. This in my opinion, a situation of unprece is rather too grave an occurrence for such dented public peril has been suddenly a lame excuse, or to be passed by as created there. My information is that an unfortunate collision." It is all whilst a meeting, addressed by English very well for the right hon. Gentleman and Irish Members of Parliament, was
to express regret at these things; but peacefully in progress this afternoon in he should have been a little wiser before, the public square at Mitchelstown, a and have taken measures to prevent this body of Constabulary armed with rifles civil war arising in Ireland through suddenly forced themselves on the meet. the mischievous policy of the Govern. ing, and eventually fired with bullets ment. on the people, killing two men on the MR. CLANCY (Dublin Co., N.): spot, and dangerously wounding several Are we to understand that the Governothers; and I am informed that one man ment have heard of this from merely an has since died. I wish to ask the right | unofficial source, and that they did not hon. Gentleman the First Lord of the think it a sufficiently grave matter to Treasury (Mr. W. H. Smith) whether inquire into and obtain official informahe or any other Member of the Govern- tion ? ment can give us any information; whe- i. MR. W. H. SMITH : As soon as the ther they are in possession of any; and information reached us, we at once teleparticularly I want to know who was in graphed to Ireland for information command of the armed forces, and who full information-on the subject. ordered them to fire ; who, in fact, is MR. SEXTON: And I wish to point responsible for this occurrence ? out that eight hours after this mur
THE FIRST LORD OF THE TREA- derous occurrence the Government are SURY (Mr. W. H. SMITH) (Strand, without information on the subject. Westminster): I am aware of the fact MR. BIGGAR (Cavan, W.): I should thatan unfortunate collision has occurred; like to ask the right hon. Gentleman the but I am not informed of the details, Leader of the House if he will adopt nor have the Government received any the practice prevailing in former Parlia. official information on the subject. It ments, and at the close of Government is, therefore, impossible for me to give Business to-day will hemove the adjournthe hon. Gentleman the information ment of the House, or does he intend which he desires. I can only express my to allow Private Business to be taken ? profound regret at the circumstance. MR. W. H. SMITH: As soon as the
MR. SEXTON: I can only protest Government Business is concluded toagainst the absence of the Irish officials morrow-or, rather, to-day-I shall when this sad affair was so well known, move the adjournment of the House. and when it might reasonably be ex- MR. J. ROWLANDS (Finsbury, E.): pected it would form the subject of a Is it the intention of the Government to Question in this House.
resist the passing of the Vacant Grounds MR. W. H. SMITH: I had not the (Nuisances Prevention) Bill, which slightest idea that the hon. Member stood for second reading last night ? had an intention to put a Question on MR. W. H. SMITH: This Bill was the subject, or I would have secured the blocked by direction of the Government, attendance in the House of one of the because there was an understanding beIrish Officers.
tween the promoter of the Bill--the hon. Mr. CONYBEARE (Cornwall, Cam- Member for West St. Pancras (Mr. borne): I should have thought that the Lawson)—and the Home Office that Government having-according to the the Bill should not be pressed if it right hon. Gentleman's own admission-were objected to by the Home Office. themselves received intimation that this There are very serious objections to it, had occurred, and knowing of this de- and therefore the Bill is blocked.
An hon. MEMBER: No notice was, ful state of brigandage" exists in the taken of this Bill last night, and when Strand between the hours of 10 and the Motion for second reading was half-past 12; and, whether he will inmade no grounds of objection were struct Sir Charles Warren to take more advanced. The treatment of this Bill effectual steps to secure
the public by the Government will be taken by safety ? Nonconformists a grievous and THE SECRETARY OF STATE (Mr. crying scandal.
MATTHEWS) (Birmingham, E.): I am
informed by the Commissioner of Police Question put.
that he is now making inquiries into The House divided :-Ayes 84 ; Noes the alleged state of brigandage in the 16: Majority 68.—(Div. List, No. 470.) Strand; but he is not at present pre
pared to say that any additional police House adjourned at a quarter are required.
after One o'clock.
SOUTH AFRICA-THE TRANSVAAL
PENSIONS. HOUSE OF COMMONS,
SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL (Kirk. caldy, &c.) asked the Secretary of State
for the Colonies, Whether the pensions Saturday, 10th September, 1887.
given as compensation for loss in office
the Colonial Vote without details, have The House met at Twelve of the ever been brought to the knowledge of clock.
the House in the same way that new
retiring allowances are always submitted MINUTES.] -- PUBLIC BILLS-Second Reading by every other Department, in Returns Appellate Jurisdiction * (234); Corouers
stating names, amounts, and cause of (378); Local Authorities (Expenses) * ; Consolidated Fund (Appropriation).
The SECRETARY OF STATE (Sir Second Reading Committee-Statute Law Revision * [379)--R.P.
Henry HOLLAND) (Hampstead): I beCommittee — Report - Considered as amended -
lieve that those pensions, not being Third Reading --Escheat (Procedure) * (373]; granted under the Superannuation Act, Sheriffs (Consolidation) * (262); Valuation were not brought in detail before the of Lands (Scotland) Amendment * (356), and House when thoy were first granted in passed.
the same manner as new pensions under Committee - Report – Third Reading – Expiring those Acts. I have already explained
Laws Continuanco (363); Prison, sollicers how they were granted upon the retroSuperannuation) (Scotland)* , and passed.
cession of the Transvaal. Considered as amended – Third Reading-Super
SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL asked, annuation Acts Amendment ;' Bank. when they first appeared on the Votes ? ruptcy (Discharge and Closure) (327); SIR HENRY HOLLAND said, he Deeds of Arrangement (No. 2) (381); presumed they appeared in 1884, the British Settlements * , and passed.
first year after they were granted.
SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL said, that QUESTIONS.
they had never been brought before
Parliament, but had been confined to METROPOLITAN POLICE - STATE OF
a confidential Report, which the right THE STRAND – “A DISGRACEFUL 1 to let bim see.
I hon. Gentleman had been good enough STATE OF BRIGANDAGE."
Sir HENRY HOLLAND said, that MR. PICKERSGILL (Bethnal Green, no details of names had ever been S.W.) asked the Secretary of State for brought before Parliament, in the same the Home Department, Whether his way as in the case of pensions under the attention has been drawn to a statement, Superannuation Act. The Vote, howmade at the Bow Street Police Court on ever, for these pensions came up every Wednesday by Mr. Vaughan, to the year; and any hon. Member could, of effect that the evidence in several cases course, make inquiry, as the hon. Mem. heard by him showed that "a disgrace- her himself did this year.
SIR JAMES FERGUSSON: The hon. EGYPT-ATTACK ON BRITISH OFFI.
Gentleman has put a great number of CERS – COMMISSION OF INQUIRY
Questions, and I cannot undertake to -MAJOR MACDONALD - FLOGGING
answer them off-hand ; but I may say OF SHEIKHS.
that a Legislative Council is not conSie GEORGE CAMPBELL (Kirk. sulted in Executive acts. The Commis. caldy, &c.) asked the Under Secretary sion, I believe, was legally constituted; of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether and the punishment of the Sheikhs was Her Majesty's Government have con due to the fact that they were Chiefs of sidered and approved the proceedings of the villagers which were concerned in Major Macdonald, British Member of the outrages upon the officers, and were the Extraordinary Commission sont to present and abetting them. try, in a summary and extra legal Sir GEORGE CAMPBELL gave manner, certain Egyptian villagers, Notice that he would call the attention particularly in sentencing to be flogged of the House to the subject on the two Sheikhs of the village, not for having earliest possible opportunity. taken part in the affray, but for not pre- MR. BRADLAUGH (Northampton) venting it, and also sentencing to be inquired, whether the affray to which imprisoned and fined a number of other the hon. Member for Kirkcaldy had Sheikhs, because they were Chiefs of called attention did not originate in a the Tribes to which the accused men British officer having wounded four out belonged ; and, whether Her Majesty's of five men-possibly by accident, and Government have approved the conduct upon a struggle arising out of the of the British Authorities who sent wounding in killing one of them right British troops and English prison out-as the officer said also by accident? warders to carry out the sentences ? SIR JAMES FERGUSSON: The
THE UNDER SECRETARY of Papers are before the House, and hon. STATE (Sir James FERGUSSON) (Man- Members are as able as I am to say chester, N.E.): Her Majesty's Govern. what is in them. I think it is hardly ment have not thought it necessary to necossary for me to repeat the explanaexpress any disapproval of the conduct tions which I gave at great length about of the British officer who took part in the affair when it occurred. the Court to which the Question of my MR. BRADLAUGH said, that if his hon. Friend refers. At the same time, reading was a correct interpretation of I must point out that I cannot adinit the Papers before the House he would that in the terms of his Question he has ask whether any steps had been taken accurately described the case as stated to punish the officer who was guilty of in the Papers before the House. I have killing ono man and wounding three no reason to think that the Court was others accidentally ? extra legal. It sat under the authority
SIR JAMES FERGUSSON: I never of the Government of Egypt; nor can I heard of anybody having been killed or admit that the Sheikhs in question were wounded, except accidentally. The hon. fogged for the reasons stated, although Member asks whether a man has been the reasons stated were probably con- punished for doing an accidental act. sidered aggravations of their offence. Certainly not.
SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL said, that MR. BRADLAUGH: The officer the Court was extra legal. He asked if himself alleges that the killing was it was not the fact that Egypt at the acoidental. At any rate, the firing was present moment was subject to certain on his part. conditions of legality; if it was the fact that there exists a Legislative Council; CRIME AND OUTRAGE (IRELAND)-THE whether that Legislative Council was
FATAL RIOT AT MITCHELSTOWN. consulted; and whether the Extra- MR. SEXTON (Belfast, W.) asked the ordinary Commission was not issued by Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant the Khedive upon his own sole autho- of Ireland, What information he can rity; could it be shown that the punish- give with respect to the action of the ment of the Sheikhs or headmen of the police at Mitchelstown yesterday? village was justifiable; and could it be THE ATTORNEY GENERAL FOR shown that they could have prevented IRELAND (Mr. Gibson) (Liverpool,
Walton): In the absenoe of my right
the affray ?
hon. Friend the Chief Secretary I have communication between Mitchelstown to inform the hon. Gentleman, with re- and London. ? gret, that we have not yet got any official MR. GIBSON: I have already said information on the subject of this Ques- that a telegram was sent last night to tion. All I know is that in regard to Mitchelstown. I believe that a further the unfortunate action of the police at telegram has been sent this morning; Mitchelstown yesterday-and there is no and I understand that arrangements doubt that an unfortunate collision have been made to keep the wire open for did take place—the police having been the purpose of transmitting information attacked, two men lost their lives in to the Government. consequence of gun-shot wounds. The MR. BRADLAUGH (Northampton): Government have sent a telegram to I beg to ask the right hon. and learned Mitchelstown, and they expect to get | Gentleman the Attorney General for Ireofficial information at the earliest pos- land whether the attempt to disperse the sible moment. I do not think it is meeting at Mitchelstown was solely in desirable, nor that the House would ex- consequence of the meeting having been pect me, to make any statement with proclaimed ? Is it the view of the Goregard to the occurrence until we have vernment that the proclamation of a that official information on the accuracy meeting which would otherwise be a of which we can confidently rely. lawful meeting constitutes that meeting
COLONEL NOLAN (Galway, N.): On an unlawful assembly, so that it may be the same subject, Sir, I should like to dispersed by force, killing all persons ask the First Lord of the Treasury a who make any attempt to resist ? Question of which I have given him MR. GIBSON: As I have already private, although I admit somewhat pointed out, it is out of my power to scanty, Notice. I wish to know whether make any statement in reference to the the Government will consider the pro- facts of the case, because, up to the prepriety of compensating those sufferers sent moment, Her Majesty's Governfrom the action of the police who may ment have received no official informanot be proved to have committed any tion. What I understand occurred is unlawful act; and in the case of those this—a Government shorthand writer persons who have been killed, if it can was, in discharge of his duty to take be shown that they were innocent parties, notes of the speeches, about to take and were guilty of no unlawful act, whe- notes of the speeches that were going to ther the Government will consider the be delivered when the police, who were propriety, in the same manner,
protecting him, were attacked. That, I pensating the families of the deceased believe, was the origin of this unfortumen ?
nate occurrence. THE FIRST LORD (Mr. W. H. MR. SEXTON: I wish to ask the SMITH) (Strand, Westminster): I fully right hon. and learned Gentleman wheappreciate the motives of the hon. and ther the police authorities conveyed any gallant Gentleman, and the entire ab- information to the conductors of the sence of anything like Party spirit in meeting that they desired to report the the observations which he has made. meeting, or made any request, as is But I am sure he will see that, in the usually done at meetings in Ireland, for absence of that complete information accommodation of the Government shortwhich we ought to possess before we hand writer on or near the platform ? at mpt to deal with so grave a ques
MR. GIBSON: I have already stated tion as this, I am unable to give him an to the House that I am not acquainted answer. If the hon. and gallant Gentle- officially with the actual circumstances man thinks it right to repeat his Ques- which took place yesterday at Mitchelstion on Monday I hope to be able to give town; but I am not aware that in order some information to the House.
to enable a policeman to discharge his MR. SEXTON: The right hon. Gen- bounden duty it is necessary to give any tleman will recollect that I called atten- prior intimation that he intends to distion to the deplorable occurrence which charge that duty. took place last evening at the rising of MR. J. O'CONNOR (Tipperary, S.): the House this morning. I will, there. I desire to know from the Attorney fore, ask whether any effort has since | General for Ireland whether he has seen been made to establishi direct telegraphic the reports in the newspapers which